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567: Meet Future You: How These GRE Listeners Built Property Fortunes

Complete episode transcript:

Keith Weinhold 0:01

welcome to GRE I'm your host. Keith Weinhold, the President has called the Fed chair a dummy and worse. How does this all affect the future of mortgage rates? Also, I discuss 30 year versus 15 year loans. Can you bundle multiple properties into one loan? Then how Fannie and Freddie going public could permanently increase mortgage rates today on get rich education

Keith Weinhold 0:28

since 2014 the powerful get rich education podcast has created more passive income for people than nearly any other show in the world. This show teaches you how to earn strong returns from passive real estate investing in the best markets without losing your time being a flipper or landlord. Show Host Keith Weinhold writes for both Forbes and Rich Dad advisors and delivers a new show every week since 2014 there's been millions of listener downloads in 188 world nations. He has a list show guests and key top selling personal finance author Robert Kiyosaki, get rich education can be heard on every podcast platform, plus it has its own dedicated Apple and Android listener phone apps build wealth on the go with the get rich education podcast. Sign up now for the get rich education podcast, or visit get rich education.com

Speaker 1 1:14

You're listening to the show that has created more financial freedom than nearly any show in the world. This is get rich education.

Keith Weinhold 1:24

Welcome to GRE from Pawtucket, Rhode Island to Poughkeepsie, New York and across 188 nations worldwide. I'm your host. Keith weinholdin, this is get rich education, not to inflate a sense of self importance, but each episode is an even bigger deal than a New York Jets preseason football game. You might have thought you knew real estate until you listened to this show, from street speak to geek speak. I use it all to break down how with investment property, you don't have to live below your means. You can grow your means as we're discussing the mortgage landscape this week. You know, I recently had a bundle of my own single family rental homes transfer mortgage servicers from Wells Fargo over to Mr. Cooper. And that was easy. I didn't have to do anything. The automatic payments just automatically transferred over. And yes, Mr. Cooper, it's sort of a funny sounding name that you don't exactly see them putting the naming rights on stadiums out there, but the new servicer prominently wanted to point out the effect of me making extra $100 monthly principal payments and how much in interest that would save me over time, sort of suggesting that it would be a good idea for me to do so. Oh, as you know, like I've discussed extensively, extra principal pay down is a really poor use of your capital. It's a lot like how in the past, now you've probably seen it like I have, your mortgage company promotes you making bi weekly payments all year, so you'd effectively make some extra principal pay down each year. That way. Don't fall for it. Banks promote biweekly payments because it sounds borrower friendly, it encourages an earlier loan payoff. Well, that actually reduces lender risk and increases your risk. And the whole program can come with extra fees too. It just ties up more of your money in something that's unsafe, illiquid, and with a rate of return that's always zero, since that's exactly what home equity is. As we're about to talk mortgages with an expert today, I will be sure to surface that topic. We'll also talk about the housing market effect of a president firing a Fed chair. When you're living under the rule of a president that desperately and passionately wants lower interest rates, you've got to wonder what would happen if a president just had the power to go lower them himself, which is actually what most any president would want to do, but you almost don't have to wonder what would happen. You can just look at what actually did happen in Turkey. Now, yes, Turkey already did have an inflation problem, worse than us, for sure, but Turkish President Erdogan went ahead and lowered Turkey's interest rates despite persistent inflation. I mean, that's a situation where most would raise rates in order to combat inflation. Well, lowering rates like that soon resulted in substantially higher inflation to the tune of almost 60. Yes, six 0% per year before cooler heads prevailed and the Turkish government was forced to drastically raise rates. But it was too late. The damage was already done to the reputation of Turkey's economy and its everyday citizens and consumers. I mean, that was a painful, real world example of how critical central bank independence is. You've also got to ask yourself a question here, do you really want to live in the type of economy where we would need a bunch of rate cuts? Because when rate cuts happen, it usually results from the fact that people are no longer employed, or we're in a recession, or financial markets are really unstable. So there are certainly worse maladies out there than where we are today, which is with moderate inflation, pretty strong employment and interest rates that are actually a little below historic levels. I mean, that is not so bad. Before we talk both long term mortgage lessons and more nascent mortgage trends today coming up on future episodes of the show here, a lot of info and resources to help you build wealth as usual. Also an A E TELEVISION star of a real estate reality show will make his debut here on GRE.

Keith Weinhold 6:24

Hey, do you like or even live by any of the enduring GRE mantras, like, Don't live below your means, grow your means, or financially free, beats debt free, or even, don't quit your Daydream. Check out our shop. You can own merch with sayings like that on them, or simply with our GRE logo on shirts and hats and mugs. And I don't really make any income from it. The merch is sold at near cost, and it actually took a fair bit of our team's time to put that together for you. So check out the GRE merch. You can find it at shop.getricheducation.com that's shop.getricheducation.com

Keith Weinhold 7:18

today we're talking to the longtime president of ridge lending group. They specialize in providing income property loans to real estate investors like you, and she's also a long time real estate investor herself. I've shared with you before that ridge is where I get my own loans. They've worked with 10s of 1000s of real estate investors, not just primary residence owners, but real estate investors as well as homeowners all over the country, and at this point, she's like a GRE icon, a fixture regularly with us since 2015 Hey, welcome back to get rich education the inimitable Chaley Ridge,

Caeli Ridge 7:54

ooh, Mr. Keith Weinhold, thank you, sir. So good to see you, my friend. Thanks for having me

Keith Weinhold 8:00

opening up that thesaurus tab right about now, I think maybe JAYLEE, why don't we have the chat everyone wants to have? Let's discuss interest rates, starting with the vitriol from Trump to Powell has reached new heights. This year, Trump has called Powell a numbskull, Mr. Too late, a real dummy, a complete moron, a fool and a major loser, among other names. And you know, at times, I've seen Realtors even blasting Jerome Powell for not cutting rates. Well, the Fed doesn't directly control mortgage rates, and it's also not the Fed's job to boost Realtors summer sales. It's to protect the long term stability of the US economy. Tell us your thoughts.

Caeli Ridge 8:48

So this is a rather complicated topic, okay, and there's a lot that under the hood that goes into how a long term mortgage bond interest rate is going to go up or going to go down. As you said, it's not necessarily just the Fed and the fed fund rate, which, by the way, for those that are not familiar with this, the fed fund rate is the intra daily trading rate between banks. So while there is a connection between that and that of the 30 year long term fixed rate mortgage, they are not the same thing. And in fact, statistically, I believe I read this last week, the last three fed fund rate reductions did the opposite to long term rates, right? So we went the other direction. So please be clear that the viral, as you say, of President Trump and what his opinions are about Mr. Powell and his decisions to keep that fed fund rate unchanged for the last several meetings that they've had, I think, is more of a distraction, but that's another conversation overall. I would say that, is he too late? Is he right on time? You know, there's so much data and so many data points that they're looking at, and there's this thing in the industry called a Lag that, in truth, they're not getting the actual data points that they need real time. It's lagging, so the data that's coming out to them today isn't going to be what's relevant and necessary to make changes tomorrow, next month and next week. Most recently, you probably saw in the news the BLS Bureau of Labor and Statistics and the jobs report came in far under what the expectation was. So that might have been the catalyst. I think that will drive Powell and group to reduce that is the overwhelming expectation that the fed fund rate is going to come down by how much. We don't know. Secondary markets are already baking that in, by the way. So when we talk about long term interest rates, I'm starting to see some changes on the day to day. I get access to that stuff, and I'm looking at it daily, the ticker tape of where the treasury bonds and things are. So I'm starting to see some slight improvement to interest rates in preparation of that market expectation, interest rate on the fed fund level will probably reduce. But I think overall, Keith that the Fed is in a really difficult position, because when you think about what really is going to drive the fed fund rate, and then potentially the long term rate, is counterintuitive to what most people or consumers expect, right? They think if the fed fund rate reduces by a quarter of a percentage point, then a long term 30 year fixed should probably reduce by the same amount. It does not go hand in hand like that. Now, while there are trends right, that doesn't happen that way, and more often than not, the worse our economy is doing, the better a 30 year interest rate will be. So in my industry, I'm kind of always playing on the fence, thinking I don't want anything bad for our country and the economy. However, the worse it does, the better interest rates are going to become. And if you've been paying attention, the economy is in decent shape. We're not doing that bad. Inflation is still up, so the metrics that they're using to kind of gage and predict that lag and where we're going to be are not in line to say that interest rates are going to drop a half or a point or a point and a half in the next year to 18 months. Those signs are not out there for me. All of that said, I know that interest rate is top of mind for I mean, I'm on the phone all day long. I like that part of my job where I'm still interfacing with investors on day to day. Big chunk of my day is spent talking to clients, and that is one of the top questions, probably one of the first questions that come out of their mouth, where interest rates? What are interest rates? And what I have sort of started to really form and say to that question is, if interest rates are the catalyst to your success in real estate, you probably need to do a little bit more research, because interest rates should not be the make or break for your success. Well, as a real estate investor

Keith Weinhold 12:45

the Fed has a dual mandate of maximum employment and stable prices. Inflation, though still somewhat elevated, has stayed about the same the past few months. History shows us that the Fed is more comfortable with inflation floating up than they are with suppressed employment levels. To your point about recent reports about us not adding many jobs, and the Fed being concerned about that, the translation for those that don't know is, if the job market is weak, lowering rates, which is what increasingly people think they tend to do later this year. Lowering rates helps encourage businesses. It's more likely that businesses will borrow and expand and hire more people. Therefore, if rates are low now, whether that translates into a lower mortgage rate or not, by lowering that fed funds rate? Yes, there is that positive correlation. Generally, the lower the Fed funds rate goes, the lower mortgage rates tend to go although that isn't always the case. To your point. Shailene, late last year, there were three Fed funds rate cuts, and mortgage rates actually went up, which is somewhat of an aberration that usually doesn't happen that way, but that's the environment we're in. Most people think Fed rate cuts are coming later this year.

Caeli Ridge 14:04

Yeah. And I would say, you know, the other thing too, when we talk about the pressure that the Fed is under right now, specifically, Powell, he's being attacked, fine, and whether I agree or disagree, really important for listeners to understand that the indifference that the Fed is supposed to have right bipartisan, it's not supposed to have a dog in that fight. If it did the calamity, I think what would happen economically in this country would be devastating if other economic powers were to see that our particular financial institutions are swayed one way or another. Politically, that would be devastating to us. So I think Powell has done a decent job at staying the course. He's continued to do what he says, says what he does. So so far, I'm okay. Is he late to reduce rates? I don't know that I'm qualified to say that, maybe. But at the same time, I think that his impartiality has been consistent, and that for that part of it, I'm. Grateful

Keith Weinhold 15:00

for those who don't understand if Trump just told Powell what to do and Powell followed Trump's orders, how does that devastate the economy?

Caeli Ridge 15:09

It shows partiality to or Fieldy to one particular party, right? It's not an independent institution where financial policy quantitative easing, quantitative tightening, all of those different things that are necessary to keep the pistons pumping. It isn't it's very specific to Fieldy and the leader of telling based on potentially ego or other elements that have not a lot to do with fiduciary responsibility.

Keith Weinhold 15:37

If Powell did everything Trump said, I feel like we would have negative interest rates right now

Caeli Ridge 15:43

that could be a problem, especially if the economy and inflation is on the rise, and then you get the tariffs. I mean, there's so much layering to this. I mean, we could go on and on about it, but overall, let me close with this. I think that interest rates are probably on the run, if I had to guess. Now, there's all kinds of variables that could make that statement untrue, but overall, in the next year to two years, I do think we'll see some relief in interest rates, barring any major catastrophe. But again, investors, if your success, if you're tying your real estate portfolio, your real estate investing, whatever modality you're interested in, if you're tying that to an interest rate, and there's a certain number that you have ethereal in your mind, you're going to lose your success in real estate. Interest rate is a component of it, but it should not be tied to your success or failure. You should be able to do the math and look at the differences in real estate opportunities, investment, whether it be long term, short term, midterm, single family, two to four appreciation, cash flow, all those things should be considered, and you will find adequate returns independent of an interest rate. If you're diversifying that way

Keith Weinhold 16:49

there is more evidence that Americans have warmed up and gotten somewhat used to normal mortgage rates. This normalization of mortgage rates, they are pretty close to their historic norms. In fact, a recent housing sentiment survey done by turbo home found that in q1 of this year, 41% of homeowners surveyed said that a 6% mortgage rate was the highest they would accept on their next purchase. Right that was back in q1 today, up from 41%, 52% of respondents now say a 6% mortgage rate is the highest that they would accept. Evidence that people are warming up and normalizing this.

Caeli Ridge 17:30

The other thing too is the pandemic rates. Right? That's been a very hard shell to crack. The people that got these two and 3% interest rates during 2020 2021, part of 22 they're really reticent to let those go, and I think that they're doing themselves a disservice as a result. If you can get a second lean HELOC, okay, fine, but overall, if you're just going to let that untapped equity sit, it's going to be to your disadvantage. If you have any desire to increase your portfolio and your long term financial stability and wealth

Keith Weinhold 17:59

you're listening to get rich education. Our guest is Ridge lending Group President Cheley, Ridge much more when we come back, including 30 year versus 15 year loans. Which one is better and more things that the administration is doing to shake up the mortgage market. I'm your host. Keith Weinhold.

Keith Weinhold 18:15

the same place where I get my own mortgage loans is where you can get yours. Ridge lending group and MLS, 42056, they provided our listeners with more loans than anyone because they specialize in income properties. They help you build a long term plan for growing your real estate empire with leverage. Start your prequel and even chat with President Cheley Ridge personally while it's on your mind, start at Ridge lendinggroup.com. That's Ridge lendinggroup.com.

Keith Weinhold 18:46

You know what's crazy? Your bank is getting rich off of you. The average savings account pays less than 1% it's like laughable. Meanwhile, if your money isn't making at least 4% you're losing to inflation. That's why I started putting my own money into the FFI liquidity fund. It's super simple. Your cash can pull in up to 8% returns and it compounds. It's not some high risk gamble like digital or AI stock trading. It's pretty low risk because they've got a 10 plus year track record of paying investors on time in full every time. I mean, I wouldn't be talking about it if I wasn't invested myself. You can invest as little as 25k and you keep earning until you decide you want your money back. No weird lockups or anything like that. So if you're like me and tired of your liquid funds just sitting there doing nothing. Check it out. Text family 266, 866, to learn about freedom. Family investments, liquidity fund again. Text family to 66866,

Rick Sharga 19:58

this is Rick sharga housing market. Intelligence Analyst, listen to get rich education with Keith Weinhold, and don't quit your Daydream.

Keith Weinhold 20:05

Welcome back to get rich Education. I'm your host, Keith Weinhold. We're talking with a familiar guest this week. That's Ridge lending Group President, Caeli. Ridge wealth is built through compound leverage faster than compound interest. And leverage means using loans. I think most everyone the first time in their life they look at loan amortization tables and learn things like, oh, with a 15 year loan, you pay substantially less interest, perhaps hundreds of 1000s of dollars less interest with a 15 year loan and its lower mortgage rate than you do with a 30 year loan and its higher mortgage rate. But a lot of people don't take that next step and look that Oh, rather than paying down my home loan with extra principal payments, if I just invested the difference, I would be substantially better off down the road. So in a lot of cases, the more sophisticated investor chooses that longer loan duration, the 30 year. That's the way I see it. What do you see? Most of your prefer there.

Caeli Ridge 21:12

It's one of my favorite topics to cover, because there's quite a few layers that I think can all connect. If an individual wants to pay less in interest very easily, I'm going to strenuously advise them to take a 30 year over a 15 year and just simply apply the difference. So let's just start with the applicable version of 15 versus 30 and how it can benefit or harm. Because this is what a lot of times people that go for the 15 year and wanting to pay less in interest. Don't understand, and it's never been delivered to them in a reasonable way, I guess. So just looking at those two, and then we'll get to the strategy of potentially reinvesting those dollars elsewhere. But just look at a 30 year and a 15 year. I am a massive deterrent against a shorter term amortization. I hate a shorter term amortization, because all that's going to do to the individual is limit their ability to qualify later on down the road. And the reason for that is, is that the shorter term, as you had described, is going to yield a higher monthly payment. So when we pull credit for an individual, that's a higher monthly payment that the debt to income ratio has to support, when in fact, if we simply just look at the two side by side, 15 year and a 30 year equal, equal loan sizes. The 15 year is going to have a lower interest rate. It's true, but the amortization is obviously half the amount. We've gone from 360 months, 30 years to 180 months, 15 years. So the payment obviously is going to be much, much higher if you take the payment difference between those two mortgage products and apply it with a 30 year fixed payment. Let's just call it 500 bucks a month, whatever the number is, and you are disciplined to send that extra 500 bucks every single month with your 30 year fixed mortgage payment. You will cross the finish line in 15.4 years, I think, is the average when you run the amortization, so you'll pay a few extra months worth of interest, but whatever, you'll never pay the higher interest that the 30 year has locked at because you've accelerated the payoff of the debt so quickly, and you've maximized your debt to income ratio and future qualifications never take the shorter term amortization. It is to your greatest disadvantage. I hate them. That's part one. Did you have a comment? I can see that your wheels are spinning.

Keith Weinhold 23:24

That is a great answer. If you get the 30 year loan instead of the 15 if you apply an extra principal payment, whatever it would be, call it 500 plus dollars, that you will kill off that loan, that 30 year loan in something like 15.4 years. Yes, and you'll have the lower payment amount for your qualification, going forward, you'll have more flexibility in your life. That's great. I didn't realize the difference 15.4 versus 15 was that small? That's a great takeaway.

Caeli Ridge 23:50

Yeah, absolutely. And the other piece, you kind of just hit on it, the individual's feet are not held to the fire at that higher payment. So let's say it's a rental, okay, whatever. It goes vacant for a month, or a couple months, God forbid, or whatever may be happening. You now get to choose. You are not obligated at that higher monthly payment. You can say, Okay, this month, I'm not going to pay the extra. I don't da, da, da. It's all within your control. So you're killing like four birds with one stone. I really prefer the 30 year amortization for all those reasons. So now let's take it and move into how I believe, and I agree with your philosophy, taking those dollars and applying them, because when we talk about mortgage interest, especially on investment property, okay, it's probably a slightly different conversation when we're talking about somebody's primary residence, home, but for an investment property to take that difference and apply it toward another investment, because the interest remember, you guys, we're investors. We want that Schedule E deduction, that interest deduction, as money goes a 30 year fixed mortgage, even today, as interest rates are elevated beyond the two and three percents that people somehow fixated on, that that's where interest rates should just be forever. You've got Mass. Amounts of interest deduction, so you're paying less in taxes. For that reason, there's so many reasons to stretch out that mortgage on an investment property versus extinguishing that debt, not to mention, you want to constantly be harvesting equity, ideally, pulling cash out. Borrowed funds are non taxable, deploying them, but then taking that extra cash flow and stockpiling it for another investment, whether that just be the down payment or for other things. I just think there's so many better places that those funds can go to produce more wealth than accelerating the payoff of that debt that's benefiting you, from a tax perspective, and several other ways. There's lots of other ways to apply that money. I

Keith Weinhold 25:43

I often ask, why accelerate the payoff on a, say, 7% mortgage interest rate loan, when instead you can take those savings, reinvest them into other real estate, where it sounds preposterous on its face to think of the rate of return that you can get from an income property, but when you add up all the five ways you're paid, appreciation, cash flow, loan pay down, made by the tenant, tax benefits and the inflation profiting benefit on the long term fixed interest rate debt, a return of 20% plus is not out of the question at all. So if it's 20, why would you pay off extra on a seven? That's 13 points of arbitrage that you could gain there by not aggressively paying down a property and instead making a down payment on another income property. Chaeli, when it comes to these type of questions and accelerating a payoff, why do banks seem to encourage that you make bi weekly payments rather than monthly payments, therefore accelerating your principal pay down.

Caeli Ridge 26:42

I'm not sure the reason behind that. I don't know that I've even seen a lot of that from my lens and my perspective. It's definitely not something I ever comment or preach on. But the overall, what's happening there when you do it the bi weekly, so instead of making $1,000 at the first of the month, you make 500 and then 500 right, middle of them on first of the month. What's happening there is, because of the way the annual calendar goes, it ends up being an extra payment per year, right? I think that's the math. Is, when you do it that way, you end up making an extra payment per year, so you can accelerate. And there's you're not doing anything different, necessarily, to in your cash flow, etc. So I don't think there's anything wrong with it. I don't know what the benefit is to the institution that would in communicate that to its consumer. Yeah,

Keith Weinhold 27:27

Yeah, it ends up being 26 bi weekly payments, which has the effect of making 13 monthly payments in a 12 month year, accelerating your pay down. In my experience, it seems that banks encourage this. They contact borrowers. They've contacted me in the past, laying out a welcome mat. Hey, would you like this plan here? And in my mind, accelerating the payoff. We already talked about how that's typically not a good investment. The more you know about the trade off between loans and equity, really, I'm transferring more of the risk onto myself and less they're onto the bank when I accelerate my payoff. So I agree. I'm not interested in doing that at all.

Caeli Ridge 28:06

You know, maybe Keith, it could be, because I people talk about this a lot, those people, and let's say that there are a group of individuals that might benefit. Let's say they're in phase three, right? They're well into retirement. They just want to start paying off. They're not maybe investing anymore. They just want to leave that legacy, perhaps, or whatever their circumstances are, and they don't want to take additional capital and apply it to the principal and lock up those funds and make them illiquid. So maybe, just as an easy sidebar, they just make two payments month versus one. I get a lot of people asking that question. I mean, over the years, I know that like at the closing table, we'll have clients say, Hey, is the servicer going to be set up to accept bi weekly payments? And a lot of times they don't like SLS. I mean, there's a lot of servicers out there that will not accept or don't have the infrastructure to collect those bi weekly so maybe just as a consumer desire out there, the servicers have gotten wise to it, and they just offer it. I can't think of the reason behind why they would promote that to their database. I don't know.

Keith Weinhold 29:09

Another question that I hear quite often, and probably do as well there is about bundling multiple properties into one loan. Can you tell us about that?

Caeli Ridge 29:20

Yeah, that's called cross collateralization. So we're taking residential property, okay, and putting them into a commercial blanket loan. So any combination of single family, up to four unit, five Plex and above is now considered commercial. So it's got to be single family, condo, duplex, triplex, fourplex, right? It's residential property, and they're taking any combination of that and putting it into one blanket loan, cross collateralizing it. Now, I believe the most incentivized way or desire to want to do this is probably for two reasons. One, to free up golden tickets, right? Golden tickets are those Fannie Freddie loans that we talk about a lot. There are 10 of these per qualified individual, if. If someone has maxed out their golden tickets, let's say they've got 12, 1314, properties, they could take five or 10 or 13, whatever the number, and put them into a commercial blanket cross collateralized loan, as long as it's non recourse. That means no personal guarantee is attached to it. The rule per golden ticket will free up all those spaces. So usually this applies to an individual that has a portfolio that has stabilized. This will usually work when the portfolio has had a couple of years to make sure that you've got your consistent tenants and anything that may come up, repairs, maintenance, et cetera, stabilized portfolios and then putting them into that cross collateralization, because the terms are not going to be the same as just a 30 year fixed Okay, especially if you're going to be looking to take cash out and harvest equity that way, that may be a real opportune time to borrow funds. Borrowed funds are non taxable once again, pull the cash out, put it into a non recourse loan. You've got half a million dollars of capital now that you can then go and get a whole new set of golden tickets for expanding your portfolio. So that's something that we focus on for individuals that have maybe maxed out of that that conventional landscape and or are looking to scale and acquire more properties, but they don't want to necessarily look at some of the DSCR loans. They want to get back into the Fannie Freddie box.

Keith Weinhold 31:22

Yeah, so someone could bundle and get cash out simultaneously, potentially, is there anything else that qualifies or disqualifies one for bundling many loans into one like this?

Caeli Ridge 31:35

It's a commercial underwrite. So they should be aware of that. Now, certainly, we're looking at the individual typically in those loans, the underwriting of those loans, the individual's liquidity and credit are most what we're focusing on, but it's about the property in the portfolio, DSCR, that debt service coverage ratio is a big factor. So we're looking at the income against the monthly expense. Generally. That's going to be the principal, interest, tax and insurance on a commercial basis, they throw in the maintenance, vacancy, et cetera, averages. So you want to see, generally speaking, about 1.2 on those when you divide the incomes and the expenses and then otherwise, yeah, LTV might be a little bit restricted on something like that, 70% usually, maybe you can get as much as 75 if you've got a really strong portfolio. But otherwise, for you, individually, liquidity, some liquidity there, and good credit is what is important. As long as the portfolio is operating at a gain, then you're good to go.

Keith Weinhold 32:32

Yeah, that cross collateralization could be really attractive. Well, Chile, we've been in this presidential administration that has shaken things up like few, if any, prior administrations have. One of those things is that they have pushed for cryptocurrency holdings to be recognized as assets in mortgage loan qualification. Now that's something that would probably pend approval by the FHFA and critics cite volatility. I mean, there's been a pattern where every few years, Bitcoin drops 80% before rebounding, and I'm not exaggerating, and that has happened a number of times. And another administration desire is this potential Fannie Mae Freddie Mac merger, or an IPO an initial public offering. Can you tell us what that's about

Caeli Ridge 33:21

let's start with the crypto first, whether or not this, this gets through the Congress and or FHFA, however, that that develops and becomes actualized, that may be different than what the lending institutions decide to take a risk on, right the allowance of that crypto so it even if it's approved and they say that, Yes, that we can use this for asset depletion or reserve requirements, or whatever it may be. I don't know necessarily that you're going to see a lot of the lending institutions jump on board. I think they'll probably have overlays. It's just kind of the layering of risk on the crypto side to ensure that the asset and the underwrite is less likely to default. I don't see a lot of lending institutions that are probably going to jump on that bandwagon immediately. That's probably going to need more time and consistency with that particular asset class. That's the crypto thing. So that's a TBD on the other side, we're talking about conservatorship. So post, oh 809, right? The housing crash and Dodd Frank, if you've not heard of those names before, they're just the last names of individuals that that rewrote that sweeping legislation across all sectors of finance. Once we saw housing and lending implode upon each other, Fannie Freddie, as a result, went into conservatorship. Now what they're saying, what the administration is saying is, is that they are going to say that the implicit guarantee actually, let me back up really, really quickly. I will not take too much time on this so Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac The reason that those products are the golden tickets, as we call them, and we're just focused on investor products right now is because highest leverage, lowest interest rate. And why is it like that? That's because it has a United States government guarantee. Against default. So this mortgage backed security is bundled up with other mortgage backed securities and sold, bought and sold on the secondary market to investors, foreign and domestic. Right? Investors that are buying mortgage backed securities, they know that that paper is secure. If it defaults. We've got the United States government that's giving us a guarantee against default. So that's why it's such a secure investment. If we come out of conservatorship, technically, that would normally mean that you may not have that implicit guarantee. However, the Trump administration and those that are in that space, FHFA, Pulte and all those guys, they're saying that that guarantee should still apply if that happens, if that's how they release this, I don't see anything wrong if they do it without all of the volatility. You know, let's use the tariffs as an example. It was all over the place. It was there, and then it was gone. It was up, and then it was down. It was 30% then it was two right? It was it was just so much, and the markets really had a hard time with it. And as a result, I think a lot of people lost massive amounts of wealth in the stock market because of that. So I think that there is some real benefits to getting the Fannie, Freddie, the GSCs, government sponsored enterprises, out of conservatorship. I think it just opens up for more fair trade in the market. But they have to do it the right way, and as long as they keep that guarantee, that government guarantee, and then they take their time and apply the steps appropriately, I think it could be a good thing, ultimately, for the consumer. Now, if they don't, it could really have devastating impacts, and I think it could even raise interest interest rates higher. I know Trump and folks don't want that, so I think they're mindful of it. That's just kind of the take I get. But we'll see,

Keith Weinhold 36:42

yeah, because that's my preeminent thought with this. Shaylee, if Fannie and Freddie come out of conservatorship, and there's no government backstop on those loans, it seems like the banks are exposed to more risk, and consequently would have to compensate for that, potentially with a higher interest

Caeli Ridge 36:57

rate. You said it better than I did. Yes, I get too technical when I go down those rabbit holes. That's exactly right. I do not think that they will go down that that path without that implicit guarantee. I expect, if this thing comes to fruition, I expect that that guarantee will be there.

Keith Weinhold 37:13

Yeah, it does seem likely, with as much administration concern as there is about the housing market and the level of mortgage rates and all kinds of interest rates out there. Well, JAYLEE, this has been a great, wide ranging conversation all the way from strategy to what the administration is doing in interfacing with the mortgage market. If someone wants to learn more about you and your products, tell us what you offer, including your very popular all in one loan there at ridge.

Caeli Ridge 37:41

Ooh, thank you for teeing that up. Yeah, especially right now, when people have a lot of concern about interest rates right or wrong, the all in one is a very unique product that removes that fear. It's a way that investors, especially can take control of their equity, pay less in interest, and sometimes hundreds of 1000s of dollars less in interest, while maintaining equity and flexibility and liquidity. Cannot say enough about this product. The all in one. First lien HELOC is my very favorite. For the right individuals, we've talked about it many, many times. They can find us talking about it all over YouTube. You and I have quite a few conversations about that. So that and so much more, guys. So the all in one, you've got the Fannie Freddie's, our debt service ratio products, our bank statement loans, our asset depletion loans, ground up construction bridge loans for fix and flip or fix and hold. We really run the gamut there in terms of loan product diversity. There's very little we can't do for real estate investors. So we're uniquely qualified in that space

Keith Weinhold 38:36

and you offer loans in nearly all 50 states. Now tell us more and how one can get a hold of your company. Yes, we are

Caeli Ridge 38:44

licensed in 49 states. The only state we're not licensed in residentially is New York. We can still do commercial there. But to reach us, you can find us on the web, Ridge lendinggroup.com you can email us info@ridgelendinggroup.com and feel free to call us at 855, 74 Ridge 855-747-4343,

Keith Weinhold 39:04

I'm so familiar with all those avenues because, again, that's where I get my own loans myself. Chaley Ridge has been valuable as always. Thanks so much for coming back onto the show.

Caeli Ridge 39:13

Thanks, Keith.

Keith Weinhold 39:21

A lot of experts believe that stripping Fannie and Freddie's public backing and taking them public, yeah, that that will increase mortgage rates. See, besides there being more risk, like we touched on there during the interview, Fannie and Freddie would face strong incentives to increase profitability, to make an IPO appealing to potential investors, that's just another reason that would probably increase mortgage rates. But if you're the type that truly champions free marketeerism, then the government would get out of Fannie and Freddie and let them IPO, and you would want. To see that happen now you as an investor, you probably resonate with the fact that rather than having to methodically and even painfully save money for your next property, instead you can just borrow funds, tax free, out of your existing property, and that way, you're using more of other people's money, the bank's money, in this case, and less of your own. Similarly, if you avoid aggressive principal pay down well, you would just retain those funds in the first place. As you can see, Chely is really good at taking a deep look at what you've got to work with and helping you lay out a strategy that might make sense, keeping in mind and evaluating your cash, cash flow, equity DTI and loan to value ratios, they offer free 30 minute strategy sessions. You can book one right there on their homepage at Ridge lendinggroup.com Until next week, I'm your host. Keith Weinhold, don't quit. Sure. Daydream.

Speaker 2 41:07

Nothing on this show should be considered specific, personal or professional advice. Please consult an appropriate tax, legal, real estate, financial or business professional for individualized advice. Opinions of guests are their own. Information is not guaranteed. All investment strategies have the potential for profit or loss. The host is operating on behalf of get rich Education LLC exclusively.

Keith Weinhold 41:31

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Keith Weinhold 42:47

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Mon, 18 August 2025

Keith discusses the recent executive order by the White House, which could bring Americans closer to retirement plan access for real estate, private equity, and crypto.

He also interviews two listeners:

Luke Frizell, a Navy officer who leverages principles from the show to invest in residential assisted living (RAL) properties, and Dr. Axel Meierhoefer, who uses turnkey properties and agricultural investments to build a diversified portfolio.

Both guests share their strategies and insights into real estate investing.

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566: Your Listener Questions - Bonus Depreciation, Realtor Fee Changes, Down Payments, Outrageous Inflation

Complete episode transcript:

Keith, welcome to GRE. I'm your host. Keith Weinhold, it's an episode focused on you as we feature two GRE listener guests today. See how they've leveraged listening to this show into real world, real estate investing action then a property opportunity to announce to you on get rich education.

Keith Weinhold 0:27

Since 2014 the powerful get rich education podcast has created more passive income for people than nearly any other show in the world. This show teaches you how to earn strong returns from passive real estate investing in the best markets without losing your time being a flipper or landlord. Show Host Keith Weinhold writes for both Forbes and Rich Dad advisors and delivers a new show every week since 2014 there's been millions of listener downloads in 188 world nations. He has a list show guests and key top selling personal finance author Robert Kiyosaki, get rich education can be heard on every podcast platform, plus it has its own dedicated Apple and Android listener phone apps build wealth on the go with the get rich education podcast. Sign up now for the get rich education podcast, or visit get rich education.com

Speaker 1 1:12

You're listening to the show that has created more financial freedom than nearly any show in the world. This is get rich education.

Keith Weinhold 1:22

Welcome to GRE from Mannheim, Germany, to Mannheim, Pennsylvania and across 188 nations worldwide. You're listening to get rich Education. I'm your host. Keith Weinhold, you probably grew up playing the board game Monopoly. Well, imagine playing Monopoly and never buying an asset that generates income. What if you just went around the board collecting $200 giving your money to the rich and trying to stay out of jail. Does that sound ridiculous? Well, that's how most people live their lives. We don't do that here at GRE we add real assets that pay us while we own them, and more and more people can potentially soon get exposure to these asset types. The White House recently reported that Trump made an executive order that is bringing Americans closer to getting retirement plan access to real estate, private equity and crypto. I mean, think about what that could do to overall real estate demand, pushing up prices. It could make the industry boom. Sort of how the advent of 401, KS helped the stock market boom. Also, another development is that in order to qualify for mortgage loans, crypto could soon be used as an asset in your mortgage qualification. That's per the FHFA, and that's what they're moving toward. Now there's been a lot of novel information and developments and stories like that this year, as we're in a presidential administration that shakes up all kinds of status quo policies, from foreign wars to tariffs to us real estate. Journalistically, it's important to be accurate and avoid misinformation and false news as the AI era is near its nascency. Still, you have got to be increasingly cautious about where you get your information. I got a stark reminder of this recently, now former presidential candidate and HHS Secretary, Robert F Kennedy Jr and I recently did a stair climber workout together at a gym. You probably know that RFK Jr leads the MaHA movement make America healthy again, which I support, and much like me, he's an avid fitness enthusiast, and that's the kind of stuff that we talk about. Well, there are now some photos of RFK, JR And I out there exercising together, something that's okay with me. I'm even proud of that. I shared one of those on my social media myself. He and I don't talk politics or vaccines or even diet or just exercise enthusiasts. That's what we talk about. That's our common ground. Well, a Facebook post of RFK JR and I exercising together, and here's where the terribly irresponsible misinformation comes in. Meta AI has a one touch link from there to what they call Weinhold and RFK Jr collaborations. Here's how it reads. I'll read it all word for word, and so much of it is false. Keith Weinhold and Robert F Kennedy Jr have a close friendship that has garnered significant attention. Keith Weinhold, a businessman and podcaster, has been a vocal supporter of Kennedy's work and advocacy their friendship has been built around shared interests and values, including their passion for environmental issues and their skepticism of mainstream narratives. Weinhold has often featured Kennedy as a guest on his podcast, where they discuss issues ranging from vaccine safety to corporate accountability. Together, they have collaborated on various projects, including the promotion of Kennedy's book the real Anthony Fauci. Their friendship has been subject to scrutiny, with some critics accusing them of spreading misinformation. That's the end of the meta AI page. What in the world? How do they come up with this stuff? The only shared interest we've collaborated on is fitness at the gym. And you as listener know that he's never been a guest on this show. Now, if his expertise were real estate investing or economics, well, then I might invite him on. How does meta AI come up with this stuff about vaccines and Fauci I mean, that is so far away from my area of focus. I haven't weighed in on any of that stuff. My gosh, this meta AI page, it is published work for all to see, and it is about 90% false. So my point is, there's a lot of information out there about everything from real estate investing to endangered sharks to cooking tomato soup. Be careful. Pay attention to information that has cited reliable sources. And AI in its current fledgling stage, it really muddies the picture. One thing that might help is that open AI's chatgpt Five, which recently debuted, it is better. It's an improvement. For example, if it does not know the answer to a question that you have, it will tell you that it does not know the answer, instead of making up something fake just to give some sort of answer like previous versions. Did we need more of that coming up here on the show. In future weeks, we have vital monolog material from me, as always prominent guests, new guests and repeat guests. Last week, I answered your listener questions here on air, you can always write in with your questions or comments at get rich education.com/contact this week, it's interviewees like you, as I talk to the first of two listener guests.

Keith Weinhold 8:17

He has been an avid GRE listener for a few years, and says that he shifted from bigger pockets and other content over almost exclusively to get rich education for real estate and market content. He uses the principles taught through GRE to focus on his niche, which is residential assisted living, R, A, l, investments at the single family home level, he owns two single family units that also have ADUs and a handful of Ral units, which has helped him reach his goal of replacing his military income with property cash flow. He is a husband, father of three boys and active duty Navy officer currently stationed in Virginia Beach, Virginia, a buy and hold investor. He began investing in real estate in 2017and now owns a portfolio that includes rental properties in San Diego, five Ral homes in Phoenix and GP stakes in two Ral syndications. He is also the founder of open range capital in the Ral room, there are two platforms dedicated to scaling the Ral model. Again, that's residential assisted living, scaling those across the US. And when he's not serving or investing, you can find him on the lacrosse field, playing, basketball, training, Jiu Jitsu or chasing down any kind of competition. Hey, welcome to GRE. Luke frazell,

Luke Frizzell 9:37

Keith, thank you for the introduction. Appreciate that very kind. And once I started investing in 2017 I got started with the bigger pockets train, and pretty avidly listened to their podcast and taking some action on my own, I actually found your podcast and your website, and it was so much more efficient in the information that I needed to hear. I. Know, and the the time that I could spend actually paying attention to real estate news and the important things that I need to be paying attention to as an investor, that I exclusively and paying attention through your email list and through your podcast, it's always great information. So I appreciate being on and thanks for having me. Keith,

Keith Weinhold 10:18

thanks. I try to keep things nutrient dense around here, Frizzell is spelled F, R, I, z, E, L, L, and look, I know your investing philosophy is strongly influenced by one of GRE most seminal and central mantras, and something that the world first learned right here on this show back in 2015 real estate pays five ways. Tell us about that.

Luke Frizzell 10:42

That is one of the best just mantras for whenever I'm talking to people about getting into real estate, yes. And I literally say, what the five ways that real estate pays, because that's how I heard about it was through you. And I was like, That is such a perfect illustration of why this beats, let's say, the stock market, or why this beats a lot of other investment vehicles, because you're not just getting the cash flow, which is a huge reason why people get involved in it, and that's actually the first thing that I'm scrubbing for whenever I'm looking for an investment. But of course, you're hoping for the appreciation, which I really just count as the cherry on top. And if I'm looking at a market from the macro lens, I'm making sure that the the city is growing, the jobs are coming in, there's a decent population, and at a macro level, that's the first thing you need to do before you dig into a city to make sure it's good to go. When appreciation happens, it's probably because those things are all in the right spot. And you're you're picking the right neighborhood, but just, you know, leverage, and being able to buy with 20% of the full amount down, that's a huge piece. And just the hedge against inflation that you get through a loan all the ways, I'm probably missing one, but that's one of the first things that I say when somebody's on the fence on whether they get into real estate investing is, Hey, these are the five ways I learned it from Keith's website, and I'll point them to you guys. That's how I found residential assisted living was really Yes, I had been an investor in San Diego and had great success there with, you know, the buy, rehab, rent, refinance, repeat, the burn method, and putting those five ways into practice. But what I really wanted, as I was looking towards getting out of the military in a few years was more the cash flow piece. So that's what drew me to Phoenix. I actually heard a podcast where somebody was talking about this strategy where you buy a home and you lease it out to a senior care operator and they are paying two to three times the lease amount that you would pay or get from a single family rental, and yet you're also getting all the benefits of real estate. So it seemed pretty hands off, which checked the box for me on that since I was working an active duty job, and then it was also very high, high cash flow. So that's what got me into residential assisted living, and has kept me into it, and I've brought a couple partners into what we're doing, and really bringing my partners in is brought us so much further than I would have ever gone myself. The core tenets of five ways real estate pays has definitely influenced my thoughts as an investor and everything that I've done

Keith Weinhold 13:16

yeah, I can't believe more people don't talk about the compelling why for real estate investing? And I think real estate pays five ways. Is the most efficient and comprehensive way of doing that for sure, when it comes to Property selection and adding to your portfolio, like you touched on, I know that you like to say that you don't chase doors, you chase quality, and you have sort of this peace of mind with intentional investing over scale. Can you tell us about that?

Luke Frizzell 13:43

That's a great question. It was really a forcing function that formed my investor mindset was it has to be quality, because I don't have the time as somebody who's doing a full time job that's very time intensive, and sometimes I'm leaving for months on end before I come back and in my spouse works in something completely separately, so she doesn't have time to manage properties and things like that. It was forced upon me to be very efficient with what I invested in, and my wife was not. She, just like me, didn't grow up learning about real estate investing, so they had to really hit bang for buck whenever we made that first investment in order to buy her or get her buy in on it. And when that first rental check came in, I was able to take her out to a sushi dinner and say it was paid for by our our tenants. And that was kind of the first buy in piece Got it, got us in there. But, yeah, I really Chase quality. And we were very fortunate, and got a little bit lucky with the timing of our properties in California with covid and the interest rates we bought to early on in 2017 and then in 2020 before interest rates started going up, before prices got crazy out there. And those have done really well for. For us. But as interest rates continued to rise and as prices on homes continued to rise, I had to keep the efficient piece in the back of my mind. That's when I heard about the senior care investing number one. I was like, hey, yeah, the demographics, it makes sense. There's so many, that demographic of seniors, the boomer generation, reaching, you know, 80 years old, and coming to that time of life where they need care that is not going down. The medical system as flawed as it can be in our country. You know, people are living longer, and we need to house them, and people don't want to stay in a big box facility anymore that feels like a hotel and not personal, and you have a one caregiver to 30 resident ratio. People want more personalized care, like you would get at a private school. At a public school, you get what you get, and you don't throw a fit, which kind of the analogy I make for a facility versus residential assisted living. So what we invest in is the residential level, where you actually buy just a regular house and it may have four or five bedrooms in it, and let's say three bathrooms, and if it's a single story home that has, let's say 3000 square feet, that is a prime home to actually build out into a senior care home. And every state needs these. Every state has different laws and rules and regulations as to what some are going to require, different size door frames, different width requirements in the halls, ramp requirements, of course, for wheelchair access and such. At the end of the day, every state needs more housing for seniors, and it's really going to be an education piece on getting people up to speed. We have five homes in Phoenix doing this, this model. There's a lot of network already available there. Like people love to retire in warm weather. Phoenix is just a hotbed for these residential assisted living homes. So that's where we got started. But when you move into, you know, let's say rural Nebraska, it's not going to be as as prevalent. So you really got to do a lot more networking and education to zoom back to your question about quality over quantity. If you think about scaling to $10,000 per month in passive income, quote, unquote, passive, the way I look at it, if I can have one residential assisted living home that nets $10,000 per month when I talk about the one residential assisted living home that could make net $10,000 per month that would be running the operations yourself, where you have let's say the average resident across America is going to pay 4000 to $6,000 per month to stay in a home like what I'm talking about if One home, let's go with the low end of $4,000 per month has a capacity of 10 residents in the house, then you can have 10 residents at $4,000 per month. So that's $40,000 gross. And then if you the average, if you're running an efficient home, just having straight up staffing costs, that maybe cost you $15,000 per month, and then you have your mortgage and your debt, that takes you another $10,000 per month, and let's say another five for excess costs and food and things, that's $30,000 of expenses. So 40,000 minus 30,000 is $10,000 per month. That's an efficiently run home. But that is not the height of what someone could do with this strategy. We have partners that do $40,000 net per month in this strategy, and that's generally in the dementia care, memory care space. What we did when we started was something called the lease to operator model, and that's a little bit more hands off, actually, I would say a lot more hands off than the actual operations of the home, like what I just said, because if you're doing the staffing and you have the business liability, that's all pretty involved, and there's a lot of education and a lot of networking that you need to do to get to that point. When I got started in this, I did the least operator model, because I was time constrained and I didn't want to actually get involved with the hands on care number one, because I was in Virginia Beach, and the homes that we were buying were in Phoenix, so there was no possible way for me to do that when we bought our first home at 10 capacity, so there's 10 residents that can fit in the home. I found an operator and vetted them and moved them into the house, and they're paying me a lease for five years, so it's somewhat of a commercial lease, but it's a residential home, and I actually got residential insurance on the house. The business owner that is leasing from me has the business liability insurance, and now they're paying me two and a half times what would have been the regular lease amount that I could have gotten for that home. So in that area, they're paying me $8,000 per month on a five year lease, and that goes up 3% per year. However, if I was renting that out like a normal house, I'm. Be getting 2020 $500 per month, every month, on a long term lease.

Keith Weinhold 20:05

That's this way the manager operates it, rather than you, right? So I

Luke Frizzell 20:09

actually empower the manager, or this operator, is what we call them. That's why it's leased to operator. I empower this manager to actually run it themselves. I don't tell them you can't paint the inside of the house. I don't tell them you can't redo the floors when you want. If they want to do that, that's on them, but they owe me that lease amount every month, and I empower them to run the home however they want. What I'm making sure happens is I'm paying for the insurance on the house, and I'm making sure the roof is stable and the walls are not going to collapse. Everything else, from utilities to whatever is on them, and they are a full fledged business owner in there, and hopefully they stay once the five years is up.

Keith Weinhold 20:48

That's a really interesting way to do it, by the way. Just dropping back to your earlier comment, I like how you say your wife doesn't have time to do the property management. I think we both know that we are protecting her standard of living and quality of life when she is not the property manager. Yes, I think it's common knowledge in America that the senior population is growing faster than the overall population. In fact, about four past GRE episodes featured the late great gene Guarino here on the show, a big educator in the residential assisted living space. We've got this aging population, the silver tsunami, the demographics about it are surely undeniable. I think a holdup for some people is that you're merging real estate investing with an active business. However, you've just described something where you're sort of withdrawing from that active business part, getting a leaseholder to pay you two and a half times the market rent, if you just had it as a buy and hold property and having them operated, is that right?

Speaker 2 20:48

Yeah, and I that's obviously a rough I say two to three times. I like to call it Airbnb numbers in a good market, without the stolen paper towels.

Keith Weinhold 20:48

You know what I mean? Like that, the stolen paper towels, the vacancy, the managing a listing, the clean. So

Speaker 2 20:48

you're doing all the you're getting the reaping the rewards of, let's say, an Airbnb without any headache. Because once you've set that operator in there, and you've empowered them to do it, and you have a rock solid lease, you're wiping your hands clean, I have to reach out to my operators to get an update from them to make sure that everything's going well, because they're not reaching out to me they're running their home. And hopefully, if I've empowered them the right way, and I am allowing them to be successful, and they reach out to me and say, Hey, Luke, I want to actually expand operations. So if you buy another house in this area, let me know, so that I can expand my operations there as well.

Luke Frizzell 21:23

Yeah. Well, do you have any last things to tell us about the residential assisted living for example, I know you have four strategies. For one, to get invested in it.

Luke Frizzell 22:44

That's a good question. And and just to hit on your last point, you're I actually like that. You can mix the real estate with the business, if you have time for that. And many people can do that, especially if you come from a healthcare background, or you're a nurse, that you're just looking to do something out on your own and not just spending your hours working at the hospital. And maybe you're a caregiver that's not paid well enough, and you're overworked, but you know that you could go and do something like that, or you're a doctor, a lot of people can go out and do this themselves, but if you're like me, and you're just a working professional that doesn't have time to get into that, but you do have people skills, and can figure out, like, Hey, I've interviewed about five different operators for this, and I can tell that this one meets all the marks, and they're going to get in there, and I can trust them, and they have a good, extensive experience in this space, and they're going to pay me a reasonable lease. That makes sense for why I'm putting the risk into this. Yeah, I'm going to pick them and get them in there. That's a really good option for people. So that's one of the strategies, is lease to operator. Another strategy is the one we already talked about, which is own and operate. So you're getting the power of real estate. You're leasing from yourself as so it's one entity, one business entity owns the property, one business entity owns the care business, and you're leasing from yourself, and there's some major tax benefits to doing it that way. That's obviously the most time intensive, and you're probably going that route if you want to make this your life's path. The other option is actually, if you don't have the money right now to buy a house, but you have the drive and you have the experience to get into the actual operations, you could just lease from somebody like me and who owns the house and doesn't want to get involved in the operations just yet, and now you can just set up a lease with them. Phoenix is a really good hub. Houston is a really good hub, but cities across America are going to start finding out about this and needing to get this into their advertise, basically because the senior housing issue that we talked about. And then finally, you can passively invest in these through open range capital, we are investing in these, and we're actually developing some memory care homes in Northern Virginia right now. So if you go to open range capital, you'll be able to find opportunities to invest in these as a passive investor. Or there's folks in the rail room who are building. Memory Care Homes in Houston area, and they're offering over 20% returns to people who just want to, hey, you have money, but you don't have time, and you don't have the interest to actually do some of this yourself. But you understand the power of residential assisted living, and the way that this medical problem and the senior care housing issue is growing in our country. Well, you can put your money there instead of doing it yourself.

Keith Weinhold 25:25

These are four distinct strategies for investing in residential assisted living, from the very much hands on to the passive hands off. Oh, this has really been helpful. Why don't you go ahead and let our audience know how they can learn more about the Raoul room and your website.

Luke Frizzell 25:42

Thanks for that. So we saw that there was a huge knowledge gap between real estate investors and business owners. And just anybody who's an entrepreneur thinking about how to get into this. You see the Cody Sanchez's of the world talking about business ownership and all those things you hear about the problem with our senior housing. And if you put those two things together, there's a huge gap in the marketplace. We wanted to educate people on this, because when we got started, there was a lot of unknowns, and it's really hard to sift through all the confusion about, you know how to get licensed. How do I know how many people I can fit into my home and actually care for? How do I find operators? How can I learn from other people who are actually doing this across the country and figure out which market to get into? So we wanted to combine all of that and have a network of people who know how to find these homes, know how to get you started in doing these and of course, we've been learning along the way as well, and that that was part of our goal as well when we started the Ral room. But we have a community of over 115 people. At this point, you can go to the ralroom.com r a l room.com and find out more. It's a great opportunity to learn about what it is. We have freebies in there about how to get started, from one to 10 step guide, and we even have a free podcast called The Ral room podcast. So tune into that. If you haven't done it yet.

Keith Weinhold 27:04

This has been informative, terrific stuff from Luke Frizzell. The audience will benefit from your point of view. Thanks for your time and intention today.

Luke Frizzell 27:14

Yeah, absolutely, Keith. Appreciate you.

Keith Weinhold 27:17

This was our first of two GRE listener guest profiles. We've got the second one when we come back. I'm Keith Weinhold. You're listening to get rich education.

Keith Weinhold 27:26

The same place where I get my own mortgage loans is where you can get yours. Ridge lending group and MLS, 42056, they provided our listeners with more loans than anyone because they specialize in income properties. They help you build a long term plan for growing your real estate empire with leverage. Start your pre qual and even chat with President Chaley Ridge personally. While it's on your mind, start at Ridge lendinggroup.com. That's Ridge lendinggroup.com.

Keith Weinhold 27:58

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Richard Duncan 29:08

this is Richard Duncan, publisher on macro. Watch, listen to get rich education with Keith Weinhold, and don't quit your Daydream. You

Keith Weinhold 29:26

this week's GRE listener guest profile is with an Air Force vet turned real estate investor, and today he even runs the ideal investor show. He's from Germany and lives in San Diego today, using strategies like turnkey real estate, 1031, exchanges and more. He now owns multiple properties in different countries and states. These include the states of Ohio, Idaho, Illinois and Florida, and the nations of Belize, Panama, Spain and more. He's been a GRE listener since episode. 100 which was in 2016 and this helped him connect with income property providers and get started and really growing his wealth through compound leverage, not just compound interest. He ultimately ended up with eight properties in what he calls well performing locations. Hey, it's great to have you here. Welcome to GRE Dr Axel meyerhoffer, hey, Keith, thank you for having me. Meyerhoffer is spelled m, e, i, e r, H, O, E, F, E R. I know that coming on to GRE is something that you've wanted to do for a while, but let's pull back first, what is your doctorate in? And then how do you use that degree or distinction today?

Dr Axel Meierhoefer 30:40

Well, my doctorate is in organizational change and leadership, and the dissertation that I wrote as the study at the end of the degree program was about business coaching and whether it's better for a company to have internal coaches versus external coaches. And when you're diving really deep, my like, I don't know if you're aware, but PhD stands, at least in my book for pilot high and deep, high and deep, right? And so, you know, I really dug into this, and what I learned about coaching is still helping me, even though idea wealth grow is a little bit more mentoring program than a coaching program, but still, the practice of engaging people and getting out of them what they really want to accomplish is valid every day

Keith Weinhold 31:28

when we wonder about what's piled high and deep, I'm sure that thing is knowledge couldn't possibly be anything else. Dr meyerhoffer, tell us what you learned from listening here that piqued your interest?

Dr Axel Meierhoefer 31:43

Well, the one thing is, I had found the book turnkey revolution, by Chris closure, who, for those who don't know he, is the one of the family members of the founders of Memphis invest that is now known as Rei Nation. I'm sure you're very familiar with it, Keith and I've heard of them. Yeah, I read the book, and it was very helpful, but it wasn't very clear, other than his family's company, how do you apply this as a regular investor, which I was at the time. And then I listened to your episodes over and over, talking about how you can use turnkey investing to invest out of state, being far away. And I remember, if I'm not mistaken, that you were in Alaska and investing somewhere in lower 48 and so that kind of got me triggered to look into that.

Keith Weinhold 32:30

You figure, if you're in San Diego, you can invest in Alabama, if a person from Honolulu or anchorage can do that same thing. All right, so you've built up, it sounds like, is it eight turnkey properties? It's

Dr Axel Meierhoefer 32:45

eight turnkey properties. And then I have a few other things, like, I also listen to episodes that you had about agricultural investing. So, yeah, like in Panama, the first investment was in a coffee farm. And then a little later, I also discovered some you would call them, like little cabin, kind of like vacation cabin investments and stuff. So yeah, I've actually learned a lot and benefited, and I always appreciated that, you know, you're not just saying, Hey, here's something you can do, but you oftentimes have a connection or relationship with an organization. And so several times my investments were at least informed, let's say, by GRE,

Keith Weinhold 33:26

yes. And oftentimes I'm investing right next to you, the investor myself, with some of the same GRE marketplace providers. You have eight properties. Are they all cash flowing? Are they all producing positive cash flow?

Dr Axel Meierhoefer 33:41

Yeah. I mean, that's actually one of the things that I wanted from the get go, and that's also part of our idea rights grow a mentoring program to look at properties now. Right now, with the higher interest rates, it's admittedly a little harder to find locations and properties that have a good balance between the quality of the property, the area that the property is in and then also being cash flowing. We have fundamentally for renovated properties. We're still looking for 1% rule. It's harder to find, but you know, as a starting point to say, Should I even consider as long as it's close to that most of the time, the numbers work out, even at seven or eight percentages, you still make at least a little bit of money

Keith Weinhold 34:20

overall. Yes, the real estate deals just aren't as good as they were, say, five years ago, because both rents and prices are up, but rents haven't risen as much as prices have. I still don't know where you're going to find a better risk adjusted return in any investment, though, than with income property bought with a loan.

Dr Axel Meierhoefer 34:42

Yeah, I'm with you on that. And I mean, I remember vividly, not in only in books and other research, that people have this apples to oranges comparison thing going on all the time, right? I always say, Okay, well, tell me if you can buy stocks where somebody gives you 80% of the money, and I already need to put 20 right? What tell me if you can buy stocks and somebody says, Oh, the stock is gonna depreciate in the next 27 and a half years. So, you know, you write some of it off your tax return, and those kind of things. Tell me where somebody gives you money but allows you to keep 100% of the increase in value all these things. I mean, you have beautiful graphics and stuff that you made over time, but when you really try to do apples to apples comparison, there's nothing there. And one thing maybe for the audience, that I think is an important thing to know is, and I know Keith, you have said this so many times, real estate, especially residential real estate and investing, is really the long term game. And that also means to realize, okay, even in times like right now, you might only start with, like, 50 or $100 positive cash flow. But when you look at the longer term, I always say, and I say this to our clients, the first five and maybe right now, it's more like seven years. It's kind of like the hard time of this investment where you just barely break even, where you might be a little disgruntled when you get a maintenance bill and you haven't really built a big reserve yet, because you're still with your first few properties, but when you look at the trajectory, and I can see it now, you know, I've six years in all properties are cash flow positive, the rate that we're getting, even if we only increase rents by 2030, $35 a month, year over year. Like you said, right? You want to train your tenants. When I look at the overall picture, it's basically getting better every year. If you have that in mind, to say, I make an investment. I call, by the way, the point what we want to get to. I call that the time freedom point where your portfolio generates enough cash flow so yet you have a choice to say, Do I go work or do I live off the income? And that is why you still have mortgages, right? So if the listeners ever think, Okay, well, what happens when one after the next, the mortgages get paid off, it's like paradise at that point, right? If you really think of it from a purely cash flow perspective,

Keith Weinhold 36:56

starting is the hardest, because it's clunky to buy your first property, and then it also takes a few years until you really feel the effect of all these wealth multipliers at the same time. You're sort of touching on the third in the inflation Triple Crown, cash flow enhancement, if you only increase the rent three or 4% per year. Yeah. So what it feels like you're only keeping up with inflation, but the fact that your principal and interest payment stays fixed means a three to 4% rent increase might be a 10% cash flow increase. As that compounds year after year, you really begin to feel those effects. But yes, it does take the addition of time, but not decades.

Dr Axel Meierhoefer 37:38

I'm with you. It's just for me, important that anybody who is considering should I get into this right, especially in an environment where people constantly pointing to the fact that the stock market keeps going up, gold is going up, silver is going up, Bitcoin is going up, right? And to me, these are the apples, and they are nice apples, don't get me wrong, right? They're beautiful apples, but we're dealing in oranges, right? And we have these five different things that you keep counting on, and have all kinds of beautiful descriptions about that we get as real estate investors. And it's a choice, right? People can make a choice, and I'm all for diversification, but if you make the choice, then you really have the beginning of building a legacy. And for many people, I find more and more that becomes important to say it's not just for me, like if you were to ask me, it's not just for me, it's also knowing that my daughter will have a much better portfolio than I ever had when I was young. Yeah, our now, like almost two year old grandson, he is going to be safe pretty much forever

Keith Weinhold 38:37

getting started and even after starting for some people, there are certain mindsets that they need to overcome. One of them is getting out of state property. So do you have any thoughts or approaches with adding out of state properties, which is still a foreign proposition to some people?

Dr Axel Meierhoefer 38:56

Well, one thing that I do and emphasize very strongly in our mentoring program is besides the investing and helping people to get the connections to like the turnkey providers and the lenders and the property managers, inspectors and stuff, the other part, and I'm sometimes almost feel, is more important than the investing itself. Obviously, it's kind of a requirement, but the other part is to really as the mentor, help people to develop the mindset of the king or queen of their own empire, or basically the owner of the investing business. And when you think about it that way, I often times portray it in the way look at all the components, all the services that you need for the out of state investor, right? You need the turnkey provider, property management, bank or lender. You need inspectors and stuff. I try to convey to people, we are building an LLC, and that LLC is hiring these people as if they were employees. And if you look at it that way, and you start adopting that mindset. And. You look at their performance like any employer would look at the performance of their employees. If the performance is great, they get praise and the raise. If the performance sucks, you let him go and get another one when you're not going to hang out with the same property management out of state, constantly complaining, not doing their job, not treating the tenants well, not treating your property well. Why would you keep somebody like that? So it's this aspect of building a mindset of, yes, you might have a job, a regular w2 job, but for the purposes of building your real estate portfolio, you are the business owner, and you're hiring all these services. And when that clicks and you start treating the people that you're working with in that way, with respect, but with every expectation that you pay them for their services so they're supposed to perform. That changes, in my opinion and my experience. That changes everything

Keith Weinhold 40:54

comes down to the fact that the team is more important than the property, and a lot of people perhaps overemphasize the geographic location of that property. Location surely matters, but it's just not nearly the most important thing I know. One approach that you take is you have this mantra that underdog properties often outperform hot properties. However, can you speak to that some more

Speaker 3 41:21

Well, I think it has to do with it, with this kind of analogy of Steady as she goes right underdog property, I'm more inclined to look in a nice neighborhood and establish nice neighborhood. I always say, Let's try, with the help of a turnkey provider, to find the ugly duckling in a nice neighborhood and get that renovated and that neighborhood, I'm not a big fan of this term blue color versus white color or anything like that, but if you bring the ugly duckling back to be the white swan of that neighborhood, you have, I believe, a very good probability that that will be a very long time longevity, well respected, well rented, well performing property, rather than, you know, running after the shiny object the most you know, like, I don't want to really open wounds, but I know that a lot of people ran to Austin, Texas, because everybody said, that's the market you gotta be in, Right prices, outrageous rents, looked good for a little while, then the property taxes got adjusted, the market collapsed, and now everybody is whining. I rather have my nice property in Dayton or in Cincinnati, and it's doing steady, as she goes, every month, every year, right? So that's what I meant by that

Keith Weinhold 42:30

a friend and prolific apartment investor, Ken McElroy, who's been a frequent guest on this show, Ken says, look for distressed properties, not distressed markets. There's a lot in that.

Dr Axel Meierhoefer 42:53

Yeah, I'm very much with Ken on that. And it's not just for apartment complexes. I think it fits just as well for single family or duplex triplex fourplex properties? Yeah, we

Keith Weinhold 43:03

want to avoid those distressed markets. It takes a long time for them to turn around, and every property in that market floats up or down with it. Well. Dr meyerhoffer, as we think about the future, you've been around this space for a while now, like you mentioned, you're even helping mentor some others. Where do you think the residential real estate market is headed the next few years? From your perspective,

Dr Axel Meierhoefer 43:27

I really have the feeling it's kind of a little bit like a coil spring that is basically being wound tighter and tighter and tighter. Because people may not agree with me. I think everybody is entitled to their own opinion, but I'm a little bit refusing to believe that the dream and the interest of owning your own property for yourself and your family supposedly has gone away. What I believe is that the circumstances both from a Can I qualify for a loan? Can I afford the price? Can my wages actually work for what I want to accomplish that balance is out of whack a lot right now, but I can totally see when we're looking in the future, that we will see interest rates coming down, properties still being in high demand. And for us as investors, I don't know if you had it on your show before, but I oftentimes being asked, you know, is it still the right time to invest. And my answer is always, like most people in residential real estate, the best time was 20 years ago. The second best time is today. Yeah. And if you adopt this idea of, like, this cold spring getting ready, I mean, just ask yourself people, the last time they really did anything meaningful was basically in 2022 let's just assume it takes another year until interest rates come down, and another six to nine months for the market to really start adjusting. So that takes us to the middle of 2027 that would mean for five years, hundreds of 1000s, if not billions, of people wanted to do something, wanted to move, wanted to get a house, wanted to get a bigger place. They've. Finally can that's kind of the window that I'm looking at with. Not to say there will never be another opportunity. But why would you wait until the market goes crazy when you have it really nice, really calm right now, almost no competition for an owner occupants. It's really an investor market right now. We can pick and we can be diligent, and we can negotiate with the builders and all this nice stuff, no time pressure. They even tell you, I know Keith. They tell you, too, when you have a client, make first sure that the client is qualified before we even talking about price. I remember times when I bought where I was told you have 72 hours to decide if you want it or not and get it under contract because of 100 people out the door who want it, it's the calm before the storm. If you ask me, I can tell exactly when that storm is really gonna hit, but nobody can convince me that if five years the market is basically frozen, that when you release it and open the door, that it's not going to be pretty crazy. Yeah, no, in my opinion,

Keith Weinhold 46:01

that's a good analogy. We're in this period where we have a compressed spring lower interest rates could open up that spring to bounce up, because we have, really, it's all this pent up demand, a pent up demand spring, and we know as mortgage rates fall, millions more people qualify increasing demand for a fixed supply of housing. Well, this has been helpful for the audience. In closing, Dr meyerhoffer, do you have any last thoughts, anything else that you want to share with the GRE audience at all?

Dr Axel Meierhoefer 46:35

Well, the one thing I would say is, you know, you want to work with somebody real estate investing, when you have somebody who has built the experience, like you have Keith with you, the programs and all the partners you're working with, similar to me, over the last 10 years, I think it's a great opportunity to do it now, where you can and have the time to learn and work together and take advantage of this relatively Calm market, because it's probably not going to stay that way. And on the other hand, I also feel that too many people are going like you said, in a slightly different context, after the current shiny object. And I would hate for people that made good money in the last year or two in the stock market to lose it all, because what goes up comes down, especially in these kind of assets, why not take some profits and put it where you really have the long term perspective, like you and I have always suggested for people,

Keith Weinhold 47:29

and is there a good resource where someone can connect with you? Because we've learned that you've taken such an interest in this and you've begun mentoring people. Is it ideal wealth grower?

Dr Axel Meierhoefer 47:38

Yeah. Idealwealthgrower.com we have a button for a complimentary conversation to just book a call. I would assume you agree. You know, when you work with people for longer term and for the personal things like money and investing, you kind of have to have a good relationship. You have to kind of in agreement where you want to go and whether you like each other and have a good energy with each other. So I always feel, let's talk, let's get to know each other. And if we decide we want to work together, then we do that. And if somebody says, You know what I really want to do, apartments. I know people. You know people, we can direct them to. Some people want to do storage units or whatever. So these conversations are really to say, let's get to know each other and see if the goals you have match with what I can help you with. And if that's a yes, then we are off to the races.

Keith Weinhold 48:24

Sort of reassuring in this algorithmic world that we live in, in this highly digital world that people you know really still matter, it's still about your connections with people. Dr Meyer Hopper, it's been great getting your perspective. Thanks so much for coming onto the show.

Dr Axel Meierhoefer 48:42

Thank you, Keith, for having me.

Keith Weinhold 48:49

Yeah, with the first GRE listener guest, Luke, it's just exemplary of how when you own the property now you make the rules, and in this case, you can increase your income multiples by converting your rental property into residential assisted living with the second listener guest, Dr meyerhoffer, I like his analogy of the coiled spring ready to open up as pent up housing demand should get released With lower interest rates. Both guests have a Military Connection, which is merely a coincidence. But today's listener guests were chosen because, unlike others that we've had here, they've each started their own real estate mentoring platforms influenced by listening to this show.

Keith Weinhold 49:35

Now in the preview to today's episode, I let you know that I have an opportunity to tell you about it's been pretty well documented that both Florida and Texas have temporarily overbuilt pockets, and this is where home builders, sometimes desperate, are willing to give you a deep deal. I've discussed Florida and their specific opportunities. What? About Texas? Listen to these deep deals, because Texas, it is one of the most in demand states for real estate investing, but cash flow is often hard to find due to property taxes and rising prices. That's why I'm excited to announce that here at GRE us with our coaches, we found a tiny stash of new construction, yet tenant occupied properties in San Antonio, the Houston suburbs and Dallas suburbs, and they are available exclusively to GRE listeners, four bed homes under 340k here's what's remarkable. There's up to $41,000 to you in incentives. That is 12% back at closing, interest only loan options as low as four and three quarter percent. Yes, they're already leased to long term tenants. This is a 19% cash on cash return potential put these properties into service and get bonus depreciation, like I discussed last week, up to $94,000 these incentives are just massive, and you can qualify with DSCR loans, no tax returns required, no w2 required. I mean, this whole thing is a bigger deal than a Bucky brisket sandwich, something else you'll find in Texas. These are all built either this year or last year. For example, like this beautiful three bed, two bath, single family rental in Conroe, Texas that I'm looking at right now. The sale price is just $279,900 and then you get all those incentives. The rent is almost $2,000 it's 1950 and it's over 1500 square feet on this really good looking property with garage. That's just an example of one of the income properties I'm talking about here. They are off market and they won't be available long. Don't miss out on this best performing Texas inventory we've seen many are already cash flowing, $500 plus a month. Chat with a GRE investment coach, and they'll show you the best picks before this inventory evaporates. Book time with them. It's free. You can do that at GRE investment coach.com. Until next week. I'm your host, Keith Weinhold, don't quit your Daydream.

Speaker 4 52:47

Keith Weinhold 53:10

You know, whenever you want the best written real estate and finance info, oh, geez, today's experience limits your free articles access, and it's got paywalls and pop ups and push notifications and cookies disclaimers, it's not so great. So then it's vital to place nice, clean, free content into your hands that adds no hype value to your life. That's why this is the golden age of quality newsletters, and I write every word of ours myself. It's got a dash of humor, and it's to the point, because even the word abbreviation is too long, my letter usually takes less than three minutes to read, and when you start the letter, you also get my one hour fast real estate video. Course, it's all completely free. It's called the Don't quit your Daydream. Letter, it wires your mind for wealth, and it couldn't be easier for you to get it right now. Just text gre 266, 866, while it's on your mind, take a moment to do it right now. Text gre 266, 866,

Keith Weinhold 54:26

The preceding program was brought to you by your home for wealth. Building, get richeducation.com

Direct download: GREepisode567_.mp3
Category:general -- posted at: 4:00am EST

Mon, 11 August 2025

Erratum: At 37:31, replace "Florida" with "California".

Keith fields listener questions on: changes to realtor fees, down payment strategies for investment properties, and how the new 100% bonus tax depreciation really works, then staggering inflation statistics that motivate you to invest in real assets.

He explains that realtor fees have shifted from a 6% listing fee to a 3% seller fee, with potential buyer contributions negotiable.

For down payments, he advises maximizing leverage while avoiding over-leverage.

Bonus depreciation allows for significant tax deductions in the first year, benefiting high-income investors.

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Connect with a recommended cost segregation engineer to take advantage of bonus depreciation here.

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565: The Tax Trap Hiding in Your Home Sale, Life's Too Short to Be Cheap

Complete episode transcript:

Automatically Transcribed With Otter.ai

Keith Weinhold 0:00

Welcome to GRE. I'm your host. Keith Weinhold, fielding your listener questions on changes to realtor fees, your down payment strategy, and how the new 100% bonus tax depreciation really works, then staggering inflation statistics that motivate you to invest in real assets today on Get Rich Education.

Keith Weinhold 0:26

Since 2014 the powerful get rich education podcast has created more passive income for people than nearly any other show in the world. This show teaches you how to earn strong returns from passive real estate investing in the best markets without losing your time being a flipper or landlord. Show Host Keith Weinhold writes for both Forbes and Rich Dad advisors, and delivers a new show every week. Since 2014 there's been millions of listener downloads of 188 world nations. He has a list show guests include top selling personal finance author Robert Kiyosaki, get rich education can be heard on every podcast platform, plus it has its own dedicated Apple and Android listener phone apps build wealth on the go with the get rich education podcast. Sign up now for the get rich education podcast, or visit get rich education.com

Speaker 1 1:12

You're listening to the show that has created more financial freedom than nearly any show in the world. This is get rich education.

Keith Weinhold 1:22

Welcome to GRE from Athens, Pennsylvania to Athens, Georgia to Athens, Greece, and with listeners across 188 world nations. You are listening to get rich Education. I'm your host. Keith Weinhold, yeah, you and I are back together for a 566th wealth building week. This is not where you learn how to create wealth through careful sports wagering at DraftKings. We also don't try to do everything like WalMart. We talk about investing actually pretty aggressively yet reasonably and responsibly at the same time. Usually those attributes are opposites, but because we are leveraging the most proven wealth building vehicle of all time, real estate, where you don't have to be the landlord. You don't need to get deeply hands on with house flipping, and you don't need to own property in your local market, though you could. We are not day trading. We are decade trading. There's not a get rich quick element here at GRE, because that doesn't work. We're owning mostly long term rental properties, bringing the financially free beats debt free approach and cognizant that compound leverage Trumps compound interest. And from the day you start focusing on this, you can retire in five to 10 years, and you can take it as far as you want, because unlike many professional sports, the sport of real estate investing doesn't have any salary cap at all. I'm starting off with three of your listener questions today. You write into the show with your questions and what I've got a few that I think could help a lot of you. I answer them here. And as usual, I start with the more introductory question, and then I proceed to the more advanced. The first one comes from Sherry In Sellersburg, Indiana. I know where that is. It's just across the river and to the north of Louisville, Kentucky. Sherry asks when I go to sell my duplex, how have last year's changes in realtor fees affected my sale costs? Yeah, thanks for the question, Sherry. And a lot of people still wonder about this first and a big little technical here, but this benefits other listeners Sherry is that a realtor means that they are a member of the NAR, the National Association of Realtors. So not all people that you enlist to help you market and sell your property are realtors, because not all agents belong to the NAR. In fact, the best catch all term for this person is not an agent. Depending on the state you're doing business in, it's probably licensee, someone licensed to act as your professional intermediary in a real estate transaction. And by the way, the name of an NAR member is a realtor. It is not pronounced real utter it's realtor, like doctor and lawyer. You wouldn't call a doctor a doctor two syllables, realtor, but to get to the crux of your question, Sherry, the changes to realtor compensation took effect almost exactly a year ago. It was last August, and it has less. Of an effect on the industry than many thought. I stated last year that it likely wouldn't affect things much, especially here on the investor side, and it really hasn't. The simplified version is that the old landscape was that when you used to list the property for sale, the listing agent charged you a fee, traditionally, 6% they offered half of that to any cooperating broker that brought the buyer to you. That was simple, and that worked for decades. That changed one year ago now, when any realtor or really licensee, when they work with you, now they simply contract with you for their fee, only like 3% as a seller of the property, you no longer have an obligation to pay for the buyer side agent as well, like you used to. But when you sign a listing agreement, you can indicate that you may be willing to concede and give an allowance to the buyer when they engage a licensee on their side to help them purchase your property. So Sherry, your voluntary contribution to the buyer side is negotiable, and it's part of the offer that the buyer presents to you. Now that's what you'll see as the seller and what you should expect as a buyer. The new landscape is that buyers negotiate a personal service agreement upfront with their licensee. Their service isn't free. I mean, these people can't work for free, and the buyer side licensee acknowledges that they will try to negotiate to get the seller to pay that fee. So Sherry, in reality, that's still what often happens. So the seller still pays that fee. In the end, the reason why is that not only is this traditional, but buyers cannot normally afford to pay for their own representation on top of their down payment and closing costs. They're often spread pretty thin already, but sellers can typically afford it. They have the upper hand financially in the form of equity in the property. And here, when you're buying properties at GRE marketplace, you don't have to pay any of those fees. We use a direct model without a licensee. So that's sort of the short version of the change, and why. I hope that helps sherry. It's a good question. Even licensees are struggling with the new rules.

Keith Weinhold 7:38

The next question comes from Jezebel in Yonkers, New York. Jezebel asks, what is the ideal percent down payment that I should make on a rental property? I'm trying to figure out the trade off between debt level, cash flow, leverage and risk. I'm still trying to get past the mindset that paid off property is best. All right, that's Jezebel's question, and Jezebel The short answer is that you want to make the smallest down payment possible while avoiding over leverage. Over leverage, meaning that your monthly payments are so big that you struggle to make them. Now, many investors that buy rental property, they're going to make a 20% down payment on a conventional loan for a single family rental. At last check on duplexes and up the down payment has to be at least 25% now you can make a down payment as low as 15% at least on a single family rental, although you would then be subject to an extra fee a PMI premium. Now, why would one do such a thing for the leverage? Because leverage is almost seven to one at 15% down, but you've got to balance that with a PMI premium. Run the numbers and see what works for you. Now, since you can make just a 20% down payment on a single family rental, conversely, why would you put 25% down? Your leverage position would slide from five to one down to four to one, where you can often get a slightly lower interest rate if you put 25% down. But when you run the numbers, you'll find that it's often better to maintain strong leverage and only put 20% down. Now, Jezebel, as soon as you start putting 30% down on a property that is questionable at 30% or more, because at that point you really have to start asking why the rate of return from home equity is always zero. It actually makes your risk go up, like I've discussed extensively before, with 30% down, your leverage ratio has been cut to 3.3 maybe the answer could be that 30% down is what it takes to produce. Positive cash flow, but putting 30% or more down is clearly not ideal. Think about how good we've got it as real estate investors here, for example, imagine that you're attracted to a dividend paying stock because it pays a 4% yield, unless you're borrowing on margin, you would need to make a 100% down payment to get that 4% cash on cash return from a dividend paying stock, 100% sunk into this, which isn't even a down payment anymore. That's just an outright free and clear stock purchase. Well, instead, in real estate, when you realize that property prices rise or fall in value regardless of how much equity is in a property, you don't have an incremental increase in your equity growth. It's a quantum leap. And here's what I mean. Jezebel, say you're investing 100k in real estate, that's how much you're going to put into it, and it appreciates at 5%. All right, there are two scenarios with that. Scenario A, you put that 100% down into just one 500k property, well, then you've got just a 25k gain after a year. Instead, with Scenario B, you put 20% down on five 500k properties, then you've got a 25k gain after a year, not just 5k Said another way more powerfully. Scenario A, you only got a 5% return on one property. In Scenario B, you got a 25% return on all of five properties. Wow. That's why the leverage light bulb, when that goes off, that is an incredible flex that you've got. That's why I say it is not an incremental gain in your wealth. It is a quantum leap. So I hope that some of those considerations really help temper your strategy there. Jezebel, that really helps you see how financially free beats debt free and exposes the opportunity cost of a paid off property. Thanks for the question.

Keith Weinhold 12:19

The next question comes from Ed, and he is a personal friend of mine, so he submitted this question by text message to me, but I wanted to address his question here, because I've had other people in my friend group ask me about this. It's about bonus depreciation, what it is. It's about bonus depreciation, what it is and how it works. And what's interesting here is that even those that aren't active real estate investors have been asking me about bonus depreciation. This was part of Trump's OB BBA, the one big, beautiful Bill Act that was signed into law back on the Fourth of July, and I told you about that last month, but because of all the questions about it and the lack of clarity around people's understanding of bonus depreciation, although it gets a little busy, let me give you a real world example with numbers on how bonus depreciation really works and how you can put 10s of 1000s of dollars in your pocket with it the next time you file your taxes. And by the way, my friend Ed that asked this question is a cargo pilot, so he is probably the most well traveled friend that I have. Yeah, through our chats and on social media, I often see that he's in China or Vietnam or a bunch of other places, but he lives in the US. In fact, bonus depreciation is encouraging more people that haven't even been real estate investors previously to newly invest in real estate because it is for properties acquired January, 20, 2025, or later, Trump's inauguration day for his second term or later. And I expect this to be effective for at least four years from that date. I think I mentioned that part to you a few weeks ago. All right, the property has got to be newly placed in service, not something that you bought, say, five years ago. Bonus depreciation does not apply to primary residences. We're talking about rental property, although it does apply to more than just rental property, because it can apply to property used in a business, like equipment, machinery and furniture, but within rental property, it applies to certain components of the real estate, not the building itself. That is on a regular depreciation schedule, and not the bare land. Land cannot be tax depreciated at all. All, neither through regular depreciation or bonus depreciation. You probably already know that a residential building itself can be depreciated over 27 and a half years. That works out to 3.6% of the value each year that can be depreciated or written off on your taxes, right? Well, what if there were portions of your building that you could write off faster, like over just five years, meaning 20% of their value each year you can, and others over seven years, meaning 14% of their value each year you can. And there's 15 year items as well. All right, so what if, instead of all that, you could take those five seven and 15 year components and just write them all off in the first year of ownership, so that you didn't even have to wait the five seven in 15 years, you can, you can write them all off in year one of your ownership of the property, and that is what 100% bonus depreciation is right there. That is in addition to writing off the main building over 27 and a half years. All right, with that understanding generally, let me break this down in more detail. Use an example, and that will also help reinforce what I just taught you, the components of rental property that bonus depreciation applies to, include the stuff that wears out faster than the building, and they are indoor items, appliances, flooring and cabinetry. At times, it can include HVAC systems, all right, that is written off in five to seven years. And then outdoor items known as land improvements, that includes fences, parking lots and landscaping. They're typically written off over 15 years. All right, let's look at a real world example on how this can benefit you. You can use bonus appreciation on single family rentals, duplexes, fourplexes and larger buildings. Let's use an example of an apartment building that you purchase for $1.2 million one we'll say the land value is 200k that is not depreciable. So the building, the depreciable asset, has a value of $1 million you must have performed what is called a cost segregation study in order to break down that $1 million building into those erstwhile faster depreciating components. And no, you cannot do the cost seg study yourself. You need to pay a few $1,000 to hire a Cost Segregation engineer to do this study. All right, let's look at the cost seg breakdown, the result of what he or she finds for you, let's say the personal property that's worth 150k its recovery period is five to seven years, and yes, it is eligible for bonus depreciation. Then you have the land improvements say that's another 50k over 15 years for a recovery period. And yes, it is bonus depreciation eligible. And then finally, you have the structure, or the building worth 800k It has a recovery period of 27 and a half years. No, it is not eligible for bonus depreciation, just the regular type. All right. Well, let me define more of this personal property for you here these five or seven year assets, these are what are eligible for 100% bonus depreciation in qualifying years. So we're looking inside the units, appliances like refrigerators, ovens, dishwashers, microwaves, washers and dryers, also flooring, carpet, vinyl and removable floating floors, not typically hardwood or tile, cabinetry and countertops in some cases, especially if they're not load bearing. Window treatments like blinds, drapes and curtain rods, ceiling fans and light fixtures, they've got to be detached from the structure and furniture, if it's a furnished rental, like perhaps a midterm rental or short term rental. So we're talking about things like beds, couches, in chairs and then in common areas. This five to seven year personal property includes fitness equipment in the gym, leasing office, computers, desks, chairs, clubhouse furniture or TVs, package lockers, like places where your tenants have their Amazon packages, playground equipment and trash compactors. All right, to be clear, that was all personal property that can be depreciated over five to seven years. And then there are those land improvements, the. 15 year assets also eligible for bonus depreciation, sidewalks, fencing, landscaping and irrigation, parking lots and striping, outdoor lighting, retaining walls and signage. Okay again, those are the land improvements, the 15 year items, things that are not eligible for bonus depreciation are the building structure itself, like I mentioned. That includes the roof framing, drywall foundations, and also things like elevators, structural plumbing and wiring and HVAC systems that serve the whole structure. Okay, all that stuff falls in the category of regular 27 and a half year depreciation. All right, so what is the 100% bonus depreciation effect? All right, well, your eligible amount in our example is 150k of personal property plus 50k of land improvements. That's 200k that you can deduct all in one year, rather than having to spread it over five and seven and 15 years. But all in year one of you owning the property that's 200k and again, the remaining 800k structure is depreciated over 27 and a half years. That works out to about 29k a year. This is where it gets exciting. Here we go. So your total year one depreciation, the year that you bought this asset and put it into service, with your bonus depreciation items adding up to 200k and your regular building depreciation at about 29k your total year one deduction is about $229,000 Wow, before I break that down some more and tell you about how it really helps you, let's just be really clear. How did you really get to the 200k of bonus depreciation. All right, let's say the cost segregation study allocated 80k to appliances, flooring and fixtures. Remember, they are the five to seven year items. Another 70k to common area, furniture and office equipment, that was the seven year stuff. All right, so there's 150k or personal property, and then another 50k to that outdoor stuff, the depreciable items known as land improvements, like the parking, landscaping and fencing, those 15 year items, that's how we got to 200k all bonus depreciation eligible, all fully deductible in year One under the 100% bonus depreciation rules, all right, so here it is. Here's the takeaway. You have front loaded an extra 200k of deductions in year one, and you have greatly reduced your taxable income. This is the outcome. This is the result. You just reduced it by 229k between the bonus appreciation and the regular depreciation. All right, so what is the effect of you reducing your taxable income by 229k in one year? Well, if you're in the, say, 32% tax bracket, you keep an extra $73,000 in your pocket. That's $73,000 that you would have had to send to the IRS for the next tax year. But no, you don't, and that is the power of bonus depreciation. That's how it works. Ed, and for all of you that asked about it, I know it's not that simple, and there were a lot of numbers flying around there, it got a little heavy, but that's a complete breakdown. That's why so many people are excited about the return of 100% bonus depreciation, as laid out in law with the one big, beautiful Bill Act, as you can see, it's going to help higher income people more than anyone. If you'd like to get this going and connect with GRE recommended Cost Segregation engineer, or just check and see if it's worth paying several $1,000 for the cost segregation study, we can help you with that. In fact, you might remember that I interviewed him on the show last year, and we will make that introduction for you and help ensure that you have a successful cost seg and bonus depreciation experience regardless of the size of your portfolio, even if you don't own million dollar apartment buildings. You don't have to have a huge income for this to benefit you. It just benefits those people the most. Well, you can set up a time to chat with us about that completely free of charge at GRE investment coach.com I think you know that's where you can also get a completely free strategy session about growing your overall real estate investment portfolio. You might as well do that at the same time at GRE. Investment coach.com. More next, I'm Keith Weinhold. You're listening to get rich education.

Keith Weinhold 25:07

The same place where I get my own mortgage loans is where you can get yours. Ridge lending group and MLS, 42056, they provided our listeners with more loans than anyone because they specialize in income properties, they help you build a long term plan for growing your real estate empire with leverage. Start your prequel and even chat with President Chaley Ridge personally. While it's on your mind, start at Ridge lendinggroup.com. That's Ridge lendinggroup.com.

Keith Weinhold 25:39

You know what's crazy your bank is getting rich off of you, the average savings account pays less than 1% it's like laughable. Meanwhile, if your money isn't making at least 4% you're losing to inflation. That's why I started putting my own money into the FFI liquidity fund. It's super simple. Your cash can pull in up to 8% returns, and it compounds. It's not some high risk gamble like digital or AI stock trading. It's pretty low risk because they've got a 10 plus year track record of paying investors on time in full every time. I mean, I wouldn't be talking about it if I wasn't invested myself. You can invest as little as 25k and you keep earning until you decide you want your money back, no weird lockups or anything like that. So if you're like me and tired of your liquid funds just sitting there doing nothing, check it out. Text family 266, 866, to learn about freedom family investments, liquidity fund. Again, text family to 66866,

Blair Singer 26:49

this is Rich Dad, sales advisor, Blair singer. Listen to get rich education with Keith Weinhold. And above all, don't quit your Daydream.

Keith Weinhold 27:07

welcome back to get rich Education. I'm your host, Keith Weinhold, if you have a listener question that you'd like to have answered on air, get a hold of us at get rich education.com/contact that's where you can either leave a voicemail or write in to us. I'd like to tell you the frequent guests that we have here on the show, all from the rich dad school, if you will, are going to be speaking in person at Penn State University in just a few weeks. Here it is on the 29th of this month. Yes, an event you can attend in person. It's going to be Robert Kiyosaki, Garrett Sutton and his son Ted Sutton and Tom wheelwright, the four of them speaking live and in person, sponsored by Penn State's Borrelli Institute for real estate studies. The event is named Rich Dad revealed Real Estate Wealth and wisdom. If that's of interest, look it up and check it out. From listening to the show and being a savvy investor that's inflation aware, you know that the mission is to turn a really fake asset, a conjured into existence asset, like $1 convert that into a real asset. Here is some astonishing clarity on why. That's the mission in this could leave you flabbergasted. Since 1980 The United States has one and a half times more homes, two times more gold today, and 42 times more dollars today. My gosh, that is almost laugh out loud material here. Yes, since 1980 the year that Jimmy Carter was president and Star Wars, The Empire Strikes Back, was the top grossing movie. The US has 56% more residential housing units today. So basically, since the year that Darth Vader told Luke Skywalker, I am your father, there are about one and a half times more homes, twice as much gold mined and brought into existence, and 42 times more dollars created out of thin air for the future, all of these trends are expected to continue at roughly the same trajectory and proportion to each other. Now, there's a reason that people use precious metals to measure inflation. It makes a particularly good measuring stick because commodities like gold, silver, platinum, palladium, rhodium and copper, they don't change over time. Unlike a car or a bottle of soda, these items are on the periodic table of the elements, an ounce of gold 1000 years ago is exactly the same. As an ounce of gold today. That's why commodities like this are such good long term inflation measuring sticks. And then there's Bitcoin, something that didn't even exist until 2009 there will only ever be 21 million of them in existence, and 95% of Bitcoins, about 20 million have already been mined into existence. So yes, only 5% more will be issued, and it's going to take about the next 100 years to do that. If bitcoins were the size of a quarter, all 21 million of them could fit inside a single shipping container. There's some fixed supply scarcity. Let's listen to this. It's about 30 seconds long, and it's called all there will ever be.

Speaker 2 30:50

Every day the Fed prints an average of $465 million that's 26,000 shipping containers a year, created out of thin air. Maybe that's why the dollar loses value over time. But there's one thing they can never print more of Bitcoin at the size of a quarter. This is all there will ever be. Shouldn't the store of value hold its value?

Keith Weinhold 31:16

That's actually a Coinbase video advertisement that we just listen to the audio of there together. Yes, what they show at the end is a shipping container where, if bitcoin were the size of a quarter, all of them that will ever exist would fit in one shipping container. And like it said, every single year, on average, the Fed prints enough dollars to fill 26,000 shipping containers, just staggering. There are so many dollars now, I'm thinking of replacing my insulation with stacks of ones. Same R value, better liquidity. Pretty soon, we won't count dollars anymore. We'll just weigh them. Welcome to the Zimbabwe starter kit. We have gone from sound money to clown money. That's another way to think of it. Oh, they say money doesn't grow on trees. That's true. It grows in spreadsheets. Now, though, one keystroke at the Fed and poof, there's another trillion just like that. Just hit the control, plus the print key. That's all it takes. All right. Well, let's take a look and see how this manifests in your life as a consumer and as a real estate investor and as a worker since January of 2020 to today, a $100,000 salary has the same buying power as 125k today. Guess over just the last five years, the dollar has lost 25% of its value, and now I'm talking in terms of the CPI here, the consumer price index. So of course, all these figures I'm using could really be higher, like we say, therefore these figures are only the inflation rate that the government is willing to admit to. How does this break down by region? So yes, we have 25% national inflation over five years, but different regions have different rates of inflation, including the region where you are, and this is due to reasons like climate and the composition of industries and even cultural preferences. For example, a southern climate with a lot of air conditioner use spends more on electricity. So if electricity costs are high there, then that region's inflation rate could be higher than that of a northern climate. A place like Omaha, Nebraska is proximous to a lot of agricultural crops and beef, but a place far from where those items are sourced could be more sensitive to changes in beef prices or less sensitive. So over the past five years, here's how much annual inflation in these select cities have experienced again, per the CPI from lowest to highest San Francisco is just 3.3% per year. So in San Fran your 100k salary in 2020 would need to be almost 118k today just to maintain purchasing power. New York City, 3.9% annual inflation over the last five years. Chicago, 4.2% Philly, 4.3 Seattle is at 4.8 Dallas, Fort Worth 4.9 St Louis, 5% Atlanta, 5.1 Miami, 5.4 we're really getting up there now. Phoenix, 5.9 San Diego, 6.1 and the major. Major city with the highest inflation rate over the past five years is Tampa, Florida, at 6.4% annually, Tampa's had some of the highest real estate appreciation over the past five years as well. So this means that a 100k salary five years ago in Tampa would have to be 128k today just to maintain purchasing power due to its 28% cumulative inflation the past five years. But that's the CPI. The real figure could be 40% plus in Tampa. All right, now this information is useful, because even if you believe that the CPI is understated, which most everyone that's looked at it does, as long as the methodology is consistent, you can see the regional variation here. Again, San Francisco was lowest at 3.3 Tampa about double at 6.4% the ever present force of inflation. It's merely surreptitious, until you have a big wave of it peaking in 2022 that everyone noticed. Let's look at how it's contributed to the real estate price run up since 2020 All right, so in the first quarter of this century, you might find this unbelievable in itself, in the year 2000 the median priced Florida home was 195k I mean, that's the median price. Then the investor sweet spot is usually lower than that. It might have been 130k in Florida in the year 2000 so again, 195k in Florida for the median home price as recently as 2000 today, it is 412k gosh, almost as surprising in Texas, It was just 153k in 2000 and it's 338k now, I mean, don't these prices like 153k in Texas, make it seem like the price for a dog house already, New York, 276k up to 576k Also from the year 2000 to today, Washington, DC, 293k up to 643k Colorado, 377, up to 582k Florida, more than doubling 393, up to 833 And Washington State also more than doubling 313k up to 630k my gosh, price increases like this. They're a function of both monetary inflation and appreciation, and it's really a chief reason that the Fed has not cut interest rates this year. It's because the memory of soaring inflation is still much too recent.

Keith Weinhold 38:05

To review what you've learned on this week's episode. Changes to realtor fees have made less industry impact than many expected. The smaller your down payment, the more powerful your leverage fulcrum. The return of 100% bonus depreciation has many investors, and even non investors, interested in adding income property to their portfolio, and staggering inflation is a motivator for adding real assets to your life. Hey, if you would, I would love it, and it would mean the world to me. If you found this episode valuable enough that you would share it with a friend. I put a lot of thought into it, just like I do every single week, friends are probably going to find explanations about realtor fees and bonus depreciation highly helpful this week, you can either share the episode by word of mouth or take a screenshot of this episode and put it on your social media. You might want to write out that it's get rich education in your social posts, because it only shows GRE on our podcast, cover image in some views. Thanks for telling a friend about the show. Until next week, I'm your host. Keith Weinhold, don't quit your Daydream.

Unknown Speaker 39:23

nothing on this show should be considered specific, personal or professional advice. Please consult an appropriate tax, legal, real estate, financial or business professional for individualized advice. Opinions of guests are their own. Information is not guaranteed. All investment strategies have the potential for profit or loss. The host is operating on behalf of get rich Education LLC exclusively.

Keith Weinhold 39:47

You know, whenever you want the best written real estate and finance info, oh, geez, today's experience limits your free articles access and it's got paywalls and pop ups and push Notes. Vacations and cookies, disclaimers, it's not so great. So then it's vital to place nice, clean, free content into your hands that adds no hype value to your life. That's why this is the golden age of quality newsletters. And I write every word of ours myself. It's got a dash of humor, and it's to the point because even the word abbreviation is too long, my letter usually takes less than three minutes to read, and when you start the letter, you also get my one hour fast real estate video course, it's all completely free. It's called The Don't quit your Daydream. Letter. It wires your mind for wealth, and it couldn't be easier for you to get it right now. Just text gre to 66866, while it's on your mind, take a moment to do it right now. Text gre to 66866

Keith Weinhold 41:02

The preceding program was brought to you by your home for wealth building, getricheducation.com.

Direct download: GREepisode566_.mp3
Category:general -- posted at: 4:00am EST

Mon, 4 August 2025

Keith discusses strategies to avoid capital gains tax on primary residences, highlighting the potential impact of the "No Tax on Home Sales Act" proposed by Representative Marjorie Taylor Greene.

He explains the current tax exemption thresholds of $250,000 for singles and $500,000 for married couples, noting that 34% of homeowners could exceed the single filer threshold.

Keith also explores the rise of small investors in the housing market, representing 30% of purchases, and the potential of peer-to-peer storage and parking platforms to generate income from underutilized property.

And concludes with a critique of government dependency through Section 8 housing.

Resources:

You can see the video footage of that section 8 clip here.

Show Notes:

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